Comments on: UFN 18: What did we learn? http://www.total-mma.com/2009/04/01/ufn-18-what-did-we-learn/ Completing the perspective on Mixed Martial Arts Fri, 18 May 2012 06:39:38 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5.1 By: Alan Conceicao http://www.total-mma.com/2009/04/01/ufn-18-what-did-we-learn/#comment-25542 Alan Conceicao Fri, 03 Apr 2009 11:04:04 +0000 http://www.total-mma.com/?p=623#comment-25542 Condit was very competitive in what I, the judges, and it seems the majority of the internet scored as a loss for him. Its not all bad. He'll make for entertaining fights against second or third tier opposition like he was against Miura and Kampmann. He's not getting cut. But he's not ascending to championship level for some time, if ever. Kampmann's future I still don't believe in. Anyone with the kind of repeated knee problems and surgeries he's had can't be counted on for a long successful career. Condit was very competitive in what I, the judges, and it seems the majority of the internet scored as a loss for him. Its not all bad. He’ll make for entertaining fights against second or third tier opposition like he was against Miura and Kampmann. He’s not getting cut. But he’s not ascending to championship level for some time, if ever.

Kampmann’s future I still don’t believe in. Anyone with the kind of repeated knee problems and surgeries he’s had can’t be counted on for a long successful career.

]]> By: EJ http://www.total-mma.com/2009/04/01/ufn-18-what-did-we-learn/#comment-25527 EJ Fri, 03 Apr 2009 04:19:06 +0000 http://www.total-mma.com/?p=623#comment-25527 "The unstoppable WEC champ was stopped against a lesser known UFC fighter who would be considered a fringe contender if the rest of the division dropped out at best." Again it's like we saw 2 different fights, Condit was in no way stopped even if you gave Kampmann the edge in the fight it was razor thin against a guy who was a beast at MW and dropped down to his natural weight at WW. Condit is very young and very dangerous he was beating guys like Trigg and Charutto when they were top 5 in the world and he was an unknown trying to make a name for himself. There is no gap in talent between Condit and anybody in the WW division is he ready for GSP? not yet but it took a while for GSP to be ready for Hughes and sooner or later Carlos will get there trust me. “The unstoppable WEC champ was stopped against a lesser known UFC fighter who would be considered a fringe contender if the rest of the division dropped out at best.”

Again it’s like we saw 2 different fights, Condit was in no way stopped even if you gave Kampmann the edge in the fight it was razor thin against a guy who was a beast at MW and dropped down to his natural weight at WW. Condit is very young and very dangerous he was beating guys like Trigg and Charutto when they were top 5 in the world and he was an unknown trying to make a name for himself. There is no gap in talent between Condit and anybody in the WW division is he ready for GSP? not yet but it took a while for GSP to be ready for Hughes and sooner or later Carlos will get there trust me.

]]> By: Dave Walsh http://www.total-mma.com/2009/04/01/ufn-18-what-did-we-learn/#comment-25508 Dave Walsh Thu, 02 Apr 2009 20:51:47 +0000 http://www.total-mma.com/?p=623#comment-25508 I thought that it was really close, and I had Kampmann winning the first round and edging out the third round. I think the big point is that Kampmann is good, but he is tough to compare to the champ. Kampmann vs. GSP would be all GSP, and if Condit was having a rough time with Kampmann, I'm not sure how he'd fare against GSP. Granted, just about anybody vs. GSP is a stretch at this point. Condit just has a ways to go. This isn't saying he isn't a good fighter; he is a good fighter. The issue is that he might not be up to snuff. This shows a clear difference between WEC's talent and UFC's. The unstoppable WEC champ was stopped against a lesser known UFC fighter who would be considered a fringe contender if the rest of the division dropped out at best. I thought that it was really close, and I had Kampmann winning the first round and edging out the third round. I think the big point is that Kampmann is good, but he is tough to compare to the champ. Kampmann vs. GSP would be all GSP, and if Condit was having a rough time with Kampmann, I’m not sure how he’d fare against GSP.

Granted, just about anybody vs. GSP is a stretch at this point. Condit just has a ways to go. This isn’t saying he isn’t a good fighter; he is a good fighter. The issue is that he might not be up to snuff.

This shows a clear difference between WEC’s talent and UFC’s. The unstoppable WEC champ was stopped against a lesser known UFC fighter who would be considered a fringe contender if the rest of the division dropped out at best.

]]> By: EJ http://www.total-mma.com/2009/04/01/ufn-18-what-did-we-learn/#comment-25502 EJ Thu, 02 Apr 2009 16:49:07 +0000 http://www.total-mma.com/?p=623#comment-25502 Poor Carlos Condit. Close decision loss, sure, but a loss nonetheless. Listen, the fact is that even if you think Condit won, and some do out there, I’m sure, he showed nothing to make me believe that he can compete with top level welters, nor should he have done it with you. Kampmann is not a ground specialist, is smaller, and has chronic knee problems. Oddly, he dominated Condit in takedowns and on the mat. So when you consider that, think rationally: How would Condit beat Fitch? Or Shields? Forget GSP. For Kampmann, a fight with he and Mike Swick would be a solid fight to elevate the winner to the next level. And yes, I am intentionally ignoring Ben Saunders in that equation. I suggest you watch the fight again after you get some glasses, Kampman in no way dominated Condit in their fight. Condit chose to stay on his back the entire round he wasn't kept there by Martin's great wrestling. Condit repeatedly showed he could get up or swith positions on Kampman during the first 2 rounds, so the idea that he was taken down and held down is ridiculous and makes me wonder what fight you were watching. Condit is as legit as the come and he more than showed that yesterday, he won the first 2 rounds and was robbed of a win over a very tough fighter. Condit has already beaten top WW's and will continue to do so in the UFC, he won last night and whoever is next for him I feel very badly for because Condit is going to work him too just like he did Kampman. Poor Carlos Condit. Close decision loss, sure, but a loss nonetheless. Listen, the fact is that even if you think Condit won, and some do out there, I’m sure, he showed nothing to make me believe that he can compete with top level welters, nor should he have done it with you. Kampmann is not a ground specialist, is smaller, and has chronic knee problems. Oddly, he dominated Condit in takedowns and on the mat. So when you consider that, think rationally: How would Condit beat Fitch? Or Shields? Forget GSP. For Kampmann, a fight with he and Mike Swick would be a solid fight to elevate the winner to the next level. And yes, I am intentionally ignoring Ben Saunders in that equation.

I suggest you watch the fight again after you get some glasses, Kampman in no way dominated Condit in their fight. Condit chose to stay on his back the entire round he wasn’t kept there by Martin’s great wrestling. Condit repeatedly showed he could get up or swith positions on Kampman during the first 2 rounds, so the idea that he was taken down and held down is ridiculous and makes me wonder what fight you were watching.

Condit is as legit as the come and he more than showed that yesterday, he won the first 2 rounds and was robbed of a win over a very tough fighter. Condit has already beaten top WW’s and will continue to do so in the UFC, he won last night and whoever is next for him I feel very badly for because Condit is going to work him too just like he did Kampman.

]]> By: Fraser http://www.total-mma.com/2009/04/01/ufn-18-what-did-we-learn/#comment-25497 Fraser Thu, 02 Apr 2009 14:38:35 +0000 http://www.total-mma.com/?p=623#comment-25497 As far as the WEC goes, this only tells us what we (and the UFC) already knew - that the weight classes shared between UFC and WEC only served to make the WEC divisions the minor leagues. Sonnen and Condit (and Varner) aren't top tier UFC champion caliber, and they never were. But don't let that put a damper on the FW and BW divisions, which is obviously where the WEC really shines. Let's hope they get that Flyweight division up and running. As for Condit's future, I think he'd be a fine WW Clay Guida - a gatekeeper who you can count on to have a good fight and will always be on the lower end of the top 10 in the UFC. And FWIW - great fight, but I'd personally call Wicky v. Cullom FOTY so far. As far as the WEC goes, this only tells us what we (and the UFC) already knew - that the weight classes shared between UFC and WEC only served to make the WEC divisions the minor leagues. Sonnen and Condit (and Varner) aren’t top tier UFC champion caliber, and they never were. But don’t let that put a damper on the FW and BW divisions, which is obviously where the WEC really shines. Let’s hope they get that Flyweight division up and running.

As for Condit’s future, I think he’d be a fine WW Clay Guida - a gatekeeper who you can count on to have a good fight and will always be on the lower end of the top 10 in the UFC.

And FWIW - great fight, but I’d personally call Wicky v. Cullom FOTY so far.

]]> By: Dave Walsh http://www.total-mma.com/2009/04/01/ufn-18-what-did-we-learn/#comment-25491 Dave Walsh Thu, 02 Apr 2009 12:28:55 +0000 http://www.total-mma.com/?p=623#comment-25491 I really think that Dos Anjos should have won due to the Volk Han reverse STF alone. My favorite part of the show was calling Cecil Peoples' scorecard for the main event, knowing he would go in the wrong direction. Gotta love that guy. I really think that Dos Anjos should have won due to the Volk Han reverse STF alone.

My favorite part of the show was calling Cecil Peoples’ scorecard for the main event, knowing he would go in the wrong direction. Gotta love that guy.

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